Clergy members who are in homosexual relationships will be able to serve as pastors, the largest U.S. Lutheran body said Saturday.
The Evangelical Lutheran Church in America passed a resolution at its annual assembly urging bishops to refrain from disciplining pastors who are in “faithful committed same-gender relationships.”
The resolution passed by a vote of 538-431.
Excellent news, although hardly the win that the headline makes it out to be. Just because someone is discouraged from doing something doesn’t mean that they are required to.
Further evidence (if any were needed) of the demise of mainline Protestantism.
As an ELCA pastor in Seattle this is terrible news. I predict the ELCA will lose 40% of its membership in the next five to ten years. There is nothing, no canons, no laws, to hold orthodox Lutherans in place and they will flee. Then the prediction of one of the ELCA’s seminary professors a few years back that ECUSA and ELCA dialoge was like necrophilia will indeed come true! And rudderless culturally captive mainline protestantism rushes into the sunset and its well deserved doom.
Please, someone, help me to understand this. The ELCA’s first resolution was to uphold the ban on practicing homosexual pastors, while their assembly also approved a resolution that will keep their “church” from disciplining practicing homosexual pastors. Do these actions make the ELCA more neurotically driven than PECUSA?
Perhaps moderate to conservative ELCA members can join “reasserting” Anglicans if there is an Anglican realignment. From what I’ve seen — and I’ve been looking at it with interest — the LCMS is quite “low church” in many places, which doesn’t suit me particularly. Would the covenant between ELCA and TEC extend to break-away Episcopalians and ELCA members?
Since TEC and ELCA clergy can serve each others churches, maybe both denominations can include each other’s membership in their own statistics. Think of it – a giant spike in membership to show they are both on a new road!!! I’ll leave it to your imagination where the road leads…
IMHO, what passed will provide cover for those bishops and synods that will now open the gates for gay or lesbian clergy to serve in congregations. It makes the 2009 study irrelevant. What cannot be held accountable cannot be disciplined. Once this door has been opened, it will be impossible to close it. So I would look for the 2009 study to suggest some sort of ordination in place. Sound like something you’ve heard before TEC folks?
On another note, I think it can also be interpreted the orthodox have two years to make up their minds. Now, congregations in our tradition own their property and can leave with it, but we have two years to prepare for the official policy change. This action of today simply allows a change without all that messy theology or policy discussion. But it does signal where it’s all going.
Tonight I’m probably feeling what many of you have felt. Though I’ve known for some time it was coming, it’s still hard for me to believe that a church built on the Lutheran Confessions could so quickly slew off into the weeds of heresy. I am a stranger in a strange land.
Maryland Brian
ELCA pastor
Who needs clergy in ELCA? In Eastern PA in one community they are letting lay people lead the communion service when the pastor is traveling.
While in many places LC-MS can be quite “low” in other places it is very “high” and has always championed a strong respect for liturgy. The LC-MS’s new “hymnal” is excellent in this regard…check it out. Their service book and hymnal stands head and shoulders above anything the ELCA and TEC have produced lately. One Episcopal priest told me that the new Missouri hymnal is the best thing since the 1940 Episcopal Hymnal.
Adam 12,
Thank you for your kind words. As an orthodox pastor leading a significant congregation, tonight I grieve over how quickly my church has lost it’s way.
Md Brian
I am so sorry to read of this and truly grieve for my bothers and sisters in Christ who are among the ELCA orthodox. How do your seminaries fare? We still have Trinity and Nashotah House to train orthodox Anglicans in the US; are there equivalents in ELCA?
http://www.elca.org/news/Releases.asp?a=3706
Just to get yer news directly . . .
MD Brian:
You walked alongside many of us, and now we will walk alongside you.
God bless you and your congregation in the months ahead.
This is such nonsense! What about homosexual pastors who are in uncommitted relationships? They are to be censured, it would appear. And why? Because it violates scripture? Or because it is immoral? And when the committed, faithful relationship becomes an unfaithful one and the homosexual pastor chooses a new boyfriend, then what? He is THEN censured because…? This is the Mass of the Absurd, what happens when fads are iinstitutionalized. What CAN these people be thinking? Larry
Just wondering Md Brian and other faith ELCA bloggers…why don’t we make our church buildings available to orthodox Anglicans in CANA and AMIA etc. for their use for mission start-ups. This would do many things: 1.) lend aid and support to fellow travelers on the orthodox path, 2.) strengthen bonds of fellowship and faith, 3) strengthen the resolve and commitment of ELCA faithful, and 4.) give a very much needed poke in the eye to the theologically bankrupt leadership of both the ELCA and TEC.
Incredible! Christianity is going to hell in a handcar. God save us.
Larry Morse’s questions are unanswerable. ELCA is making up its own rules and only ELCA can provide the answers — which may change at least as often as it meets in convention.
This is the same kind of hypocrisy that is presently being practiced in the Presbyterian Church USA. The denomination’s Book of Order is clear that homosexual conduct is incompatible with being a minister. The liberals tried for years to get this changed, with the proposals being defeated each time by increasing margins.
So they got around the Book of Order by getting an “authoritative interpretation” passed at the last General Assembly that says that notwithstanding the requirement of the Book of Order, whether or not to follow it will be up to the individual sessions and presbyteries in the exercise of “conscience.” Voila! You have gotten rid of the fundamental requirements of the Book of Order without having ever amended them!
#9 — Thanks for the info! That sounds encouraging. I’ve thought of LCMS as an alternative if the AC falls apart but was discouraged by the local congregation seeming very “low church.” I will check out others in the area.
MDBrian, I’m sorry you’re going through this and I hope it helps at least a bit to know you’re in good company. These decisions pierce our souls, especially when the other side treats it as a political win, as if this was part of a campaign. Ooops, I forgot — it is, isn’t it? Sigh…
My condolences Maryland.
#19–In my area, a lot of Episcopalians have fled to LCMS, because we don’t have any “safe” orthodox Episcopal churches here, nor do we have any of the new various Anglican church plants, and LCMS is the only liturgical alternative if you’re not going to go back to Rome.
#1, Brian: “Excellent news”
I know this kind of speech is frowned upon on this blog, but it needs to be said.
You, sir, are a walking joke and a sorry excuse for a biblical Christian.
There. Let the elves and reappraisers swarm upon me. I don’t care. The Truth is the Truth.
Were any of you present at the ELCA Assembly? I was. This is bad, but it is not the train wreck (yet) that MSNBC is reporting. One of the ELCA bishops (augghhh! a bishop!), Bishop Landahl of Metro Chicago (leaving office soon, but not soon enough) offered up as a substitute amendment this piece that encourages bishops to refrain from disciplining gay and lesbian pastors in committed relationships. What does this mean? The bishops who have already been doing this will continue to do so; the bishops who have been following the constitution will/can continue to do so. The passage of this thing is a scandal in the church, but it is not the end of the ELCA. The bylaws and disciplinary documents were *not* changed. However, it is time to get serious instead of wringing our hands and crying in our beer.
Lutheran CORE is urging those who want to take back their church to gather on September 28 at St. Mark Lutheran Church in Lindenhurst, Illinois (near Chicago) for ‘This Church’ and God’s Church. We will talk about what happend and make our battle plans for the next two years. We want to sell out the joint. All who share the goal for faithful reform in the ELCA need to be there. If anyone is interested they should go to the website of http://www.wordalone.org for more information.
But for pity’s sake, quit complaining and *do something!!!*
23, best of luck and we will be praying for you, but you are now where we were 6-7 years ago.
This is almost exactly parallel to the passing of D039 at ECUSA General Convention 2000:
[blockquote]Resolved, We acknowledge that while the issues of human sexuality are not yet resolved, there are currently couples in the Body of Christ and in this Church who are living in marriage and couples in the Body of Christ and in this Church who are living in other life-long committed relationships, and be it further
Resolved, We expect such relationships will be characterized by fidelity, monogamy, mutual affection and respect, careful, honest communication, and the holy love which enables those in such relationships to see in each other the image of God, and be it further
Resolved, We denounce promiscuity, exploitation and abusiveness in the relationships of any of our members, and be it further
Resolved, This Church intends to hold all its members accountable to these values, and will provide for them the prayerful support, encouragement and pastoral care necessary to live faithfully by them, and be it further
Resolved, We acknowledge that some, acting in good conscience, who disagree with the traditional teaching of the Church on human sexuality, will act in contradiction to that position, and be it further
Resolved, That in continuity with previous actions of the General Convention of this Church, and in response to the call for dialogue by the Lambeth Conference, we affirm that those on various sides of controversial issues have a place in the Church, and we reaffirm the imperative to promote conversation between persons of differing experiences and perspectives, while acknowledging the Church’s teaching on the sanctity of marriage. [/blockquote]
There were heated debates at the time about whether D039 was merely descriptive, or was prescriptive. Bishop Peter Lee wrote at the time that “The Center Has Held.” Susan Russell’s words proved prophetic:
[blockquote]As someone who was widely quoted from Denver as admitting that D039 was not the whole enchilada, I still find a enough guacamole there to give me reason to rejoice … as a lesbian, as a priest, and as an Episcopalian. D039 was and is a huge step forward in the process of articulating a theology of relationship that transcends sexual orientation — and gives us the room to engage with those in our congregations and dioceses who have said “we want to get past ‘the gay issue’ and talk about mission.” So here’s their chance: we’re not taking about issues … we’re talking about what makes a holy relationship and where the church’s responsibility is in supporting ones that are … acknowledging that such relationships take more than one form and (named or not) that same gender couples can and do fit that criteria.[/blockquote]
So, to my friends in the ELCA, I say sadly: This is not the whole enchilada, but have some guacamole.
#23: Stop complaining and do something! Bless your heart, dear, to have someone else say that.
The war is on, and turning the other cheek in ElCA will do nothing but give the pc left the leverage it needs for a tail to wag a fairly large dog. Unless, of course, the whining stops and whole congregations decide to act. LM
And of course, Dr. Witt, ECUSA has never been able to tell us on what authority it can “expect such relationships will be characterized by fidelity [and] monogamy.” The Authority many of us would cite to answer that question is one that would have ruled D039 out of bounds in the first place.
#25: “Who are living in other life-long committed relationships.” Please forgive my sputtering but this is such pious blather. If the relationship turns out not to be life-long, what then? TEC throws the book at them (although they appear to have forgotten which book this is)? For what? That they split? Does this mean heterosexuals who split (after swearing to lifelong committed relationship) also get The Book? Why not three homosexuals in a life long committed relationship? Do they get TECular contumely dumped on their heads? Or do they make the cut? There is in this the absence of a standard greater than the wishes of the writers. The statement is therefore as evanescent as a maidenhead in a sorority. Larry
#27, 28.
This is why, for me, it is clear that GC 2000 was the deciding moment, and GC 2003 was merely the inevitable consequence. All of the questions about “Windsor-compliance,” invitations to Lambeth, etc., should have been addressed immediately after GC 2000 so we would not have be still discussing this now, seven years(!) later. GC 2000 clearly rejected Lambeth 98. The Anglican Communion should have disciplined ECUSA then.
#21: This is a huge issue in many parts of the country. Here in Birmingham, we have Advent plus a number of other strong Anglican parishes. In Tucson, where my wife and I spend alot of time, LCMS is the only option for me. On the whole, I am very comfortable with the LCMS theology and approach, and have a deep respect for them.
#23: I fear that for ELCA this is the beginning of the end. I ask again, in what shape are your seminaries? Do you have any that are orthodox? If you lose all of the seminaries, then the end is nigh.
MD Brian: Our prayers are with you and your flock. God is faithful.
#30: That ELCA has taken this action is proof to me that they have already lost the seminaries. I don’t consider it possible that any significant number of Christians, honestly and seriously studying the Bible, could independently come to the conclusions reached by a majority of TEC and ELCA. This kind of thinking has to be disseminated and supported from a central source.
If ELCA is to survive at this point, the orthodox are going to have to make one heck of a goal-line stand.
#30…as far as I know all of the seminaries are left leaning. Unlike TEC all of our seminaries are owned by the church and are linked geographically to our synods. I understand that it is possible for a seminarian to graduate without being totally brainwashed but all of our seminaries seem to be bastions of left leaning political correctness…so, yes, in many ways the end is nigh…but not with out a rip roaring good fight. As I said earlier (an I am in a liberal synod) 30% to 40 % of the ELCA will flee…even here in this synod. Families with children will feel the most betrayed and after they read this morning’s paper or the next Lutheran magazine the exodus will begin. Several young families in church I serve have already told me that they will leave over this. It is my difficult duty to ask them to stay and fight. But, of course, many of them won’t because they want their church to be a place of peace and a zone of safety and now, in their minds, the ELCA has pulled out the rug from beneath them. I too grieve for a church that generations of my family have served as pastors and bishops.
We are called to bear witness and to fight the good fight for the sake of the Gospel. We are not called to seek safety. There were over 400 people who voted against this at the Assembly. I will not break faith with them.
This fight is far from over. It has just begun.
Dear Wamark and Katie My Rib, Again, I am so sorry to hear of what is going on. For sure it is definitely necessary to continue to witness to the truth of the Gospel. My concern is that for ELCA as an institution, without any orthodox seminaries, I just do not see long-term survival in the Gospel. At least on the Anglican side, we have the two orthodox seminaries, and in Canada they have Wycliffe. My understanding is that ELCA is of relatively recent vintage, am I correct on this? If 30-40% will flee, this is still a sizeable number; perhaps there could be consideration of fleeing together into a new confessing Lutheran denomination if LCMS is not an option? But the first priority will be to establish a seminary because without it, even this will have difficulty in the long-run. Y’all are in my prayers.
#29–Dr. Witt. In retrospect you are correct. At the time, in 2000, many of us were hoping 20/20 would refocus ECUSA/TEC. It had some momentum at first, but as soon as Louie Crew et al figured out what 20/20 might actually do, the PB and EC pulled the plug on it. It is a significant reason why the orthodox know that the current agenda in TEC is only a political agenda,and clearly not of the Spirit as the leadership of TEC now claims. We were wrong to be hopeful about TEC. But there is still good news. I read the book and I know how it turns out.
The article posted here August 11 regarding the Stumme-Diers resolution that was voted down Friday, says that it was voted down 581-450. That would be 1, 031 voters.
Now this resolution passed Saturday, passed by a vote of 538-431. That would be 969 voters. It looks like 43 conservatives but only 19 progressives left before the Saturday vote.
#35,
Actually, the lutheran seminary in Gettysburg, PA is one of the oldest in the US. The ELCA as an institution is relatively young, but was constructed by merging a host of lutheran bodies together. At twenty years of age there’s also not much institutional loyalty either. It could all come apart rather easily.
As per the seminaries, we have none that are purposefully orthodox. That why I visited Trinity in Pittsburgh this past spring. My congregation and others will need to explore where to find their next pastoral leadership.
Brian
ELCA Pastor … but of the orthodox bent.
Thanks for your comments Katie (and your work at the assembly). At the risk of pushing the analogy too far, goal line stands do not always succeed, but they do have a way of bringing the team together. And that could be valuable, extremely valuable, for the orthodox if the ELCA does do the whole enchilada in 2009.
With regard to seminaries, it is in my opinion one of our steepest hills that we do not have a Trinity or Nashotah in the ELCA. That said, my understanding is that there is still a critical mass of orthodox professors at a couple of our seminaries, at least, such that it is possible to get a fairly orthodox education IF you know enough to carefully exercise your course options. BUT retirements are fast changing that picture. For that reason, increasingly our orthodox pastors will have to come from non-ELCA seminaries or from new alternative seminary initiatives.
For my own part, whatever happens in the ELCA in 2009, I seek to be able to say only that I did what I could, and everything that I could. I urge all who would stand for orthodoxy in the ELCA to join us at the Lutheran CORE national gathering Sept. 28 in suburban Chicago. As many of you faithful Anglicans have shown me, it is time to “choose this day whom you will serve.”
Ryan Schwarz
Lutheran CORE Steering Committee
MD Brian wrote:
[blockquote]Tonight I’m probably feeling what many of you have felt. Though I’ve known for some time it was coming, it’s still hard for me to believe that a church built on the Lutheran Confessions could so quickly slew off into the weeds of heresy. I am a stranger in a strange land.[/blockquote]
Brian et al., I have great compassion for you and you are certainly in my prayers. I read the following from time to time when I need encouragement. Hope you find it an edifying reminder.
“Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are those who mourn, for they will be comforted. Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth. Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled.”
#38: Trinity is a fabulous seminary. Their former President, Paul Zahl, introduced me to Luther while he was our Dean at Advent. In fact, one of the things that most draws me to Lutheranism as an option is that the overall teaching is the closest I have found to what we hear at Advent. I know that when PZ was at Trinity, he warmly welcomed postulants from other denominations to study there. Another option might be Beeson here in Birmingham, Alabama. I think that at some point, if there is an orthodox realignment, one of the priorities will be to establish a new seminary.
As Carl Bratten said, “… the bottle is empty.”