The lethal mishandling of Israel’s attack on a ship carrying humanitarian supplies that was trying to break the blockade of Gaza was bound to provoke outrage””and rightly so. The circumstances of the raid are murky and may well remain that way despite an inquiry…But the impression received yet again by the watching world is that Israel resorts to violence too readily. More worryingly for Israel, the episode is accelerating a slide towards its own isolation. Once admired as a plucky David facing down an array of Arab Goliaths, Israel is now seen as the clumsy bully on the block.
Israel’s desire to stop the flotilla reaching Gaza was understandable, given its determination to maintain the blockade. Yet the Israelis also had a responsibility to conduct the operation safely. The campaigners knew that either way they would win. If they had got through, it would have been a triumphant breaching of the blockade. If forcibly stopped, with their cargo of medical equipment and humanitarian aid, they would be portrayed as victims””even if some, as the Israelis contend, brought clubs, knives and poles. As it was, disastrous planning by Israel’s soldiers led to a needless loss of life.
For anyone who cares about Israel, this tragedy should be the starting point for deeper questions””about the blockade, about the Jewish state’s increasing loneliness and the route to peace. A policy of trying to imprison the Palestinians has left their jailer strangely besieged.
Israel IS and has been under siege — truly, concretely — from the first instant of its existence. The Arab world has stated specifically, clearly and forcefully on many occasions that it wants nothing less than to wipe Israel off the map entirely. Indeed, there are maps in “Arabic” countries that do not even indicate the existence of Israel at all.
So maybe they have something to worry about after all.
[blockquote] Yet the Israelis also had a responsibility to conduct the operation safely. [/blockquote]
None of the press accounts ever point out tha five out of the six boats were boarded smoothly. That the sixth only lost nine lives, given the violence seen on the video tape (which only FoxNews and blogs are showing), is actually quite remarkable.
Helen Thomas spoke the truth. She had the guts to say what many people, including anti-Israel liberals actually think. Ms. Thomas said:
[blockquote]”Tell them to get the hell out of Palestine. Remember, these people are occupied and it’s their land. It’s not Germany, it’s not Poland.”
Asked where the Jews should go, she said “Home.” Where is that? “Poland, Germany, America and everywhere else.”[/blockquote]
Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10159/1063920-84.stm?cmpid=nationworld.xml#ixzz0qGfjMB6O
However she left out some specific locations like Auschwitz, Dachau and Theresienstadt, Babi Yar which is in Russia and “…4,950 cities, towns, villages, hamlets and shtetls where Jews were systematically murdered”. Berenbaum, The World Must Know, Little, Brown (1993)
Maybe if Israel loses they will get what they want.
In 2008, Hamas terrorists indiscriminately fired 3,278 rockets and mortar shells (1,750 rockets and 1,528 mortar shells) against innocent Israeli civilians . After Israel legitimately stopped the blockade running vessels, Hamas launched 2 (two). In fact, for all of 2010 so far, Hamas terrorists were only able to indiscriminately fire a total of 78 rockets and mortar shells (45 rockets and 33 mortar shells) against innocent Israeli civilians.
The blockade seems to be working.
Hamas terrorists still illegally hold the Israeli soldier Gilad Shalit hostage. I believe that if they release him, the blockade would be eased. The existance of Gaza as a Palastinian enclave was supposed to give Israel peace – land for peace. Instead, the Palastinians have had a civil war and the radical terrorists element that won that cannot effectively rule their own people and are waging an illegal terror campaign against Israel.
I wonder if any of the people saying Israel could have conducted these operations more safely has ever actually been in a fight. You cannot predetermine the outcome of hand to hand combat no matter how well trained you are. If someone is coming at you with a metal pipe, you react. It’s REALLY gonna hurt if you don’t. I sometimes think these persons would rather Israeli soldiers died…..
Jews can be forgiven their siege mentality. After all, they have been
hounded to death over the last 2 millenia by secular and
religious authorities. More sinned against than sinning.
Israel’s seige mentality is fine until it affects American interests. It will be harder for us to protect ourselves as Israel burns the bridges of even its Jordanian and Turkish friends.
Sick and tired, the blockade was started simply because the Palestinians elected Hamas democratically. Perhaps not a wise move on their part, but since Israel wasn’t even negotiating with Fateh and Hamas promised to clean up Palestinian government, the average Palestinian thought Hamas was the better deal. Granted, it wasn’t wise, but there is some rationality to it. If Israel won’t give the Palestinians anything, then why choose the weaker, corrupt party? Their attitude is that at least Hamas stands up for itself.
After the blockade, Hamas started firing rockets. Unfortunately the idea that force can crush an enemy simple breeds deeper resistance. Force is working someonewhat. There are more people malnourished. Poverty and suffering are endemic. But for some people – both the Israelis and the Palestinian – being threatened just makes people believe in force.
Of course, Israel does see itself at war. But then, are the Palestinians? So one side can declare war, and the other uses terrorism? Perhaps the Palestinians think of themselves as under seige as well.
You can’t expect peace when war is the game you play. It goes both ways.
Ahem…”After the blockade, Hamas started firing rockets.”
Palestinian terrorists have been firing rockets at the innocent Israeli civilians for a lot longer than the recent advent of the blockade of Gaza. Palestinian rocket and mortar attacks on Israel from the Gaza Strip have occurred since 2001. The blockade didn’t start until June 2007.
The blockade is working just fine. In 2008 there were 3,278 rockets and mortar shells fired at Israel by Pallestinian terrorists. In 2010, there have been only 78. That’s about a 98% reduction in rockets and mortar shells being fired at innocent Israeli civilians by Palestinian terrorists. I’d say that was a fantastic success.
So why should Israel stop the blockade? Food, medicine, and other essentials are being allowed in to Gaza. I believe that the figure was something like 10 -14 thousand tons of non-military supplies per week are being trucked into Gaza by the Israelis so that this isn’t a humanitarian issue.
This is an issue about weapons and munitions or materials to fabricate military equipment not being allowed into Gaza. I think that is great! The Israelis are using the least force necessary to stop the terrorist attacks on their citizens and they have managed to reduce them by about 98%. That is awesome.
Now, if the Palestinian terrorists will release Gilad Shalit, there might be an opportunity to dialogue for a less restrictive blockade.
By the way, Egypt is also blockading Gaza. They won’t open the border because that would be a recognition of Hamas as a legitimate government, which Egypt does not consider them to be. What does Egypt know about Hamas legitimacy that you do not? Do you have words of criticism for them, or is it only Israel that suffers your disapproval?
Oh, by the way…
The Hamas Charter (1988)
Article 7 of the Hamas Covenant has this in it:
“The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews, when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews.”
Article 32 of the Covenant has this in it:
“Today it is Palestine, tomorrow it will be one country or another. The Zionist plan is limitless. After Palestine, the Zionists aspire to expand from the Nile to the Euphrates. When they will have digested the region they overtook, they will aspire to further expansion, and so on. Their plan is embodied in the “Protocols of the Elders of Zion”, and their present conduct is the best proof of what we are saying.”
So, they quote the “Protocols of the Elders of Zion” in their official government documents as though it were true and are acting in accord with that belief. Do you think that Hamas is a legitimate government? Do you think that they will act peacefully toward Israel under any circumstance? Is there anything that Israel could do (other than self destruction) that would satisfy Hamas so that they would let Israel live in peace?
Sick and Tired: Don’t you know that facts just get in the way of The Narrative?
By the way, I was wondering: where did you find the precise figures regarding rocket and mortar attacks?
Hi David,
Wiki (I know, not the most reliable source – but there were 86 footnotes from what appeared to be credible sources) appeared to have a very good timeline with a day by day record of rocket (including their type) and mortar round attacks.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel,_2008
Oh…this was the source for the 2010 data. I added up the attacks myself from the timeline.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel,_2010
Again, there were 75 footnotes, most with links, to what appeared to be credible sources.
During the Gaza war there were 288 children and 103 women who were killed. I haven’t computed how many Israelis were killed. I wonder if these deaths might make Palestinians angry? Or do they shrug their shoulders? Not sure how they are supposed to feel. It seems pretty idealistic to think they’ll blame themselves when the guns and bullets were Israeli. I might be a little upset if my people were killed.
Sick and Tired promotes the tired trope that because Hamas has in its constitution the elimination of Israel, they can’t be negotiated with. This shows a pretty shallow understanding of Palestinian internal politics. Hamas has indicated several times they are willing to live peacefully within a two state solution, but there is little incentive for them to do so because there are no direct contacts. About 4 years ago, the political leader of Hamas in Syria, Khaled Meshaal, gave a very revealing interview with a Pro-Fateh newspaper saying that, although they in their hearts believed that Palestine was for the Palestinians, their de facto position was a two state solution. Essentially the charter has no practical political significance. Except for those who use this as an excuse not to negotiate with Hamas.
It’s still a hardline position. Hamas isn’t a bunch of choirboys. But since both Israel and Hamas believe (rightly, perhaps) that the other wants to destroy them, there’s little incentive. Since Israel is the stronger partner, perhaps it is time for them to privately make some changes in their policy, which is clearly not working.
What is also true is that every state has, at some point, negotiated with terrorists: Algeria; the IRA; even the Irgun. The use of force doesn’t work long term. Which is probably what Jesus would say.
“…the charter has no practical political significance.”
Ah, then why don’t the Palestinians just drop it from their charter? If their stated aim of the elimination of Israel isn’t significant, then they could just remove it and take away that “excuse not to negotiate”, right?
“Since Israel is the stronger partner, perhaps it is time for them to privately make some changes in their policy, which is clearly not working.”
Since Israel is the stronger “partner”, don’t you think Hamas should make the concessions? As far as Israel’s policy not working…a 98% reduction in rocket and mortar attacks speaks for itself. Also, if it is such a failure as a policy, the Hamas should be dancing in the streets about Israel’s failure. The fact that Hamas doesn’t like having their weapon supply cut off seems like the best evidence that the policy is a great success. A blockade is much better than an invasion…don’t ya think?
Sick, I first want to note a couple slippery things. First, Hamas is not all the Palestinians. Changing charters, of course, is challenging. It took many years for us to treat blacks as humans and change our constitution. Personally, I think facts on the ground and institutional changes are more important. I can’t convince people not to be racists and wave the confederate flag (which, to me, is unamerican), but I can enforce real policies that allow for peace. Asking Palestinians to purify their hearts is like asking whites to give up race supremacy in their hearts. Not easy to do. Can’t mandate it. Stick to practical political situations.
A success? Well, Israel is even more isolated, losing its few Islamic allies; Hamas is still in power; and the Palestinians are still suffering. Its hubris and belief in force allows for a few short term victories, but internally, Israel is divided. It is, itself, becoming a fundamentalist regime. If it was really a success, it would be living at peace with its neighbors.
It is impossible to live in peace with neighbors that state as part of their foundational government documents that they wish you to be completely annihilated and then do everything in their power to bring that about. What more could Hamas do to convince people that they hate Israel and would destroy every Israeli man, woman, and child if they could? They have already strapped explosives to their bodies and detonated themselves in order to try to kill a few Israelis at the same time. When they have the munitions, they constantly and indiscriminately launch rockets and mortar rounds into civilian populations trying to kill any Israeli they can. They have suicide brigades that have dedicated themselves to suicide attacks just for the chance to kill Israelis.
What does it take to convince some people that Hamas will NEVER live in peace with Israel? Hamas is not rational. Hamas cannot be reasoned with. Hamas is all about terror and murder. There is no peace with Hamas. Fathi Hamad of the Palestinian Legislative Council stated on Al-Aqsa TV, “For the Palestinian people death became an industry, at which women excel and so do all people on this land: the elderly excel, the Jihad fighters excel, and the children excel. Accordingly (Palestinians) created a human shield of women, children, the elderly and the Jihad fighters against the Zionist bombing machine, as if they were saying to the Zionist enemy: ‘We desire death as you desire life’.”
Even Human Rights Watch has condemned Hamas, stating: “There is no excuse for calling civilians to the scene of a planned attack. Whether or not the home is a legitimate military target, knowingly asking civilians to stand in harm’s way is unlawful”. In a 2002 report, Human Rights Watch stated that Hamas’ leaders “should be held accountable for the war crimes and crimes against humanity” that have been committed by its members.”
How can anyone defend these racist murdering holocaust denying war criminals that deliberately target children and hide behind civilians? There is no gray here. There is no nuance. There is nothing “slippery” about this. Hamas is EVIL.