Support for Glasspool among Episcopalians is not universal. The Diocese of South Carolina has begun to withdraw from some national church councils over policy on homosexuality. The Rev. Dr. Kendall S. Harmon, canon theologian of the diocese, said Glasspool’s confirmation, which he considers “a foregone conclusion [among Standing Committees],” is “just going to increase the challenges” for church conservatives.
“What people don’t realize is, this is an evangelistic issue,” he said. “Down here, having ‘Episcopal’ on the sign is a huge net negative for people trying to grow their churches. If we don’t distance ourselves in this diocese, what we have is parishioners who say, ‘I love you, I love this parish, I love God, I love Christ. But I don’t want any part of the Episcopal Church if they’re going to do this.’ ”
Four Episcopal dioceses and several parishes have broken away to form the Anglican Church in North America, a conservative body seeking separate recognition within the Anglican Communion. The Vatican, meanwhile, has announced plans to make it easier for Anglicans to join the Catholic Church.
The Rev. Susan Russell, president of the gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender advocacy group Integrity USA, called such losses “the cost of discipleship.”
i want to be quite clear on my view on the consent process. I think the Standing Committes is a foregone conclusion, but I think the only interesting question is what the bishops do. While full consent is the most likely outcome from the bishops, it partly depends on the international reaction and their own discernment.
Given Rowan Williams quick and strong (for him) early response there is a remote chance–a remote one–that the bishops vote could be interesting.
There is no question of the position of the Province of TEC in terms of the new theology and practice it has embraced against the mind of the Communion.
Addressing Canon Harmon’s selected text above, two messages. The first is that the entire Episcopal Church is not “down here”, and in many instances it is addressing the needs and concerns of “out there”. Second, having Episcopal on the sign is a burden only if you choose to preach it as such. I have attended two Eriscopal churches in the Upstate. In the first the priest hates his church because of a never ending list of transgressions real and imagined, behaves as though he does, and his church is dying. In the second the priest is also very conservative but believes the needs of his parish and the message of Christ are more important than the actions of the Church outside his diocese. His church is growing. Priests and parishes make the choice. Preach judgement and hate, wither and decline. Preach Christ’s message of love, tolerance and forgiveness, and behave like you believe it, and flourish.
It’s not required to have the word Episcopal on one’s church sign. I certainly don’t. We removed the ‘E’ word in 1995.
For Ms. Russell to equate TEC’s massive losses as a result of following the heterodoxy of the pro-homogenital agenda with Bonhoeffer’s theology of “cheap grace” is both laughable and ironic.
Bonhoeffer opposed the butchery of Nazism with his own life as an expression of his faith in Jesus. The LGBT lobby pursue a “scorched earth” agenda against people who dare to oppose them politically, organizationally and theologically (including violence in various forms). Among the ways TEC uses this approach is in violating its own canons to depose people and stealing property they did not purchase from other followers of Jesus in court.
So who is more indicative of Bonhoeffer: Susan Russell or Marc Robertson (Christ Church, Savannah)?
-Jim+
[blockquote]David C. Steinmetz, a professor emeritus at Duke Divinity School, says relations may now be strained to a breaking point.
“For the first time, it seems very possible to me that the Episcopal Church may lose its place in the Anglican Communion not against the wishes of the Archbishop of Canterbury but with his full consent,” he said. “What is not clear to me is whether the effective governing majority of the Episcopal Church even cares.”[/blockquote]
I’m not clear on that, either.
Dear SR, I find your use of the phrase “the cost of discipleship” to be offensive in this context. Take a break and read the Bonhoeffer book. Then, perhaps you could explain your intent in drawing this parallel, in a way that I could understand.
Let me register my strong agreement with Fr.Jim (#4) and Ralph (#5). For Susan Russell+ to appeal to Bonhoeffer’s notion of the “cost of discipleship” as if she and her ilk were being faithful to the gospel and suffering for it when in fact the very opposite is true is rionic indeed. Extremely ironic. And yes, quite offensive as well.
But that only goes to show that she has traded the biblical and authentic gospel in for the so-called gospel of inclusivity, which is actually no gospel at all (ala Gal. 1:6-9).
But thanks Kendall, for clarifying whet you meant in your #1, and by highlighting the part in bold in the newspaper quote. Alas, I find over optimisitc even your assessment that there’s a REMOTE chance the HoB will heed the call for “gracious restraint” from the ABoC. I’d say there’s maybe a 1% chance of that. So I’d prefer to say, there’s NO chance of the Standing Committess refusing to consent, and an EXTRMELY REMOTE and virtually non-existent chance that she’ll not get the necessary consents, in light of the vote on D025 this past summer at Gen Con.
What’s more interesting is the chance that Cantaur may actually allow something to be done to sideline and quarrantine TEC in second class “associate” status in the AC, in line with the whole Windsor Report strategy. To my mind, that’s the only interesting question. And how remote or otherwise that chance may be is still a matter for speculation.
But on the question of whether the “effective governing majority” in TEC even cares, as Prof. Steinmetz put it, I think that a minority may care, but I regard it as highly likely that the majority really don’t give a damn. Just look at the defiant tone of +Bruno’s statement after the election. He openly mocks the idea of “capitulating” to “titular heads” in the AC.
How utterly American. And how utterly arrogant and unChristian.
David Handy+
RE: “Preach judgement and hate, wither and decline. Preach Christ’s message of love, tolerance and forgiveness, and behave like you believe it, and flourish.”
Oh dear . . . it appears by the parish stats charts that TEC gives us every year that the majority of the parishes in the diocese are, according to Doug, preaching “judgement and hate.”
I somehow doubt that that is the case.
Kendall is correct. The word “Episcopal” is generally mocked in South Carolina, whether upper diocese or other. The key is to sharply distinguish the local from the national, and that strategy has certainly worked out nicely for the “lower” diocese.
RE: “For Susan Russell+ to appeal to Bonhoeffer’s notion of the “cost of discipleship†as if she and her ilk were being faithful to the gospel and suffering for it when in fact the very opposite is true is rionic indeed. Extremely ironic.”
Note, though, that it is a tacit admission of decline and loss — quite a change from the cries of “the oppressed will be flocking to our church in droves and we’ll grow and thrive” meme from 5 years ago.
The other thing to observe is that she basically cycles through 5-6 boilerplate phrases and clauses, sometimes stringing them together in clumps of 2-3, for pretty much any communication anyway.
Rather like whirling a Buddhist Prayer Wheel about and seeing what it lands on.
It is quite clear that those governing the Episcopal Church quite agree with “The Rev. Susan Russell, president of the gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender advocacy group Integrity USA, (who) called such losses “the cost of discipleship.” The gayification of the ECUSA/TEC is their sole goal. It is their gozpell. One cannot have any doubt of that whatsoever after the actions of GC2009. Chickens have roosted. And the loss of the farm is of no consequence to them. In fact, it would be much better for such if all the other animals either became chickens or left. Actually, they prefer left.