Yet the idea of non-traditional protesters using bottom-up organizing to foment a national movement in the span of 60 days may have marked a turning point for the tea partiers ”“ especially since the high attendance estimates rivaled the estimated 500,000 or so protesters who converged on New York City and several other major cities to oppose the Iraq War on Feb. 15, 2003.
“I think it’s not dissimilar from what we had in 2003 with the anti-war protests, where a lot of people were uncomfortable with the war, but also uncomfortable with the anti-war position, recognizing there are terrorists out there,” says Jeremi Suri, a history professor who specializes in social movements at the University of Wisconsin in Madison. “Here we have a similar thing: There are serious economic issues, and it’s unclear to many people whether the stimulus is going to deal with these.”
CNN only started reporting the tea parties the day before and then they had the rude reporter who dismissed it as “just anti-government” and promoted by the “right wing” Fox news, not really family viewing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOrPzVECSjo
[blockquote]Critics doubt the higher estimates of the turnout, and say the numbers represent the extreme right[/blockquote]. To liberals, the term “extreme right” is redundant.
[blockquote] Jeremi Suri, a history professor who specializes in social movements at the University of Wisconsin in Madison.[/blockquote]
UWMadison (AKA Berkeley East)
The CNN reporter was Susan Roesgen, who was not reprimanded.
[Comment edited by Elf] The Obama administration issued its DHS ” radical rightwing crazies” report to precede the Tea Party events – it wanted to shut down the opposition by providing advocacy masquerading as analysis – the analysis suggested that the American Legion was a ‘hate’ group – said “information” was provided by the left-leaning Southern Poverty Law Center. Interestingly, the mob activity of ACORN is never mentioned. There was a comparative reference in the DHS report comparing the Tea Party movement to the Weather Underground and likened tea party attendees to neo-nazis. It was a deliberate but bad attempt to get people to not show up at tea parties [ they might be photographed, their licenses recorded ]. It was an attempt to identify so-called risky people by their political beliefs.
I went to the tea party in San Diego – all ages, families, college students, retirees, etc. Everyone had a great time, lots of smiles and signs – it was nice to feel that there are others as concerned as you. Frustration but not anger was the order of the day.
My dad was one of the organizers for the West Palm Beach Tea Party. He says the same as Branford. He also says there was no room in the plaza in front of City Hall, and that the parking garage across the street had people lined up on every level (4?) with signs, etc. No anger, plenty of frustration.
He also was one of the organizers at an anti-illegal immigration rally on Saturday. He notes the police were out in force, but was not sure which side they were there to ‘protect’, after reading the DHS report summary. Also peaceful, with a few politicians in attendance.
The UW-Madison professor says, “There are serious economic issues, and it’s unclear to many people whether the stimulus is going to deal with these.” I think it’s fair to say that the overwhelming majority of tea party participants think the “stimulus” is pork-barrel spending, not stimulus.
Juandeveras, you say: “There was a comparative reference in the DHS report comparing the Tea Party movement to the Weather Underground and likened tea party attendees to neo-nazis.” I haven’t read the full DHS report. If this is true, it’s a vile thing to put in the report, completely outrageous. I did wonder if government agents would be out on April 15 taking names and photos. They wasted their time if they did.
I saw the CNN segment in the airport. This was a prime example of trying to twist news to suit the reporter’s agenda. It’s no wonder that people who only read the main newspapers and watch CNN often have warped ideas about conservatives.
The distortions on CNN, just like Fox, are systemic, not occasional. It is, in both cases, a worldview which is not self-reflective and therefore incapable of self-critique.
The irony of the “everything is political” deconstructionist “insight” is that it has not made politically infused reporting less frequent but in fact more brazen. Again, unreflectively so.
#7. Albany+,
[blockquote]The distortions on CNN, just like Fox, are systemic, not occasional.[/blockquote] And just where will we go in your view for objective reporting? Frankly, I’ll watch Fox news knowing their commenting is slanted without the discomfort of people like Keith Olberman shouting his insane and angry comments at me. Folks like Brit Hume and Chris Wallace are a welcome contrast to Katie Couric, and Tom Brokaw who have had a national platform for years.
The CNN “report” on the Chicago Tea Party protest was on Headline News, not a commentary program. Certainly, Fox News commentary programs have bias (O’Reilly, Hannity, etc.). If you look at the actual news coverage, during the day and on the main two evening news programs and on the Sunday morning talk show, you’ll find that Fox makes a much more sincere effort to give the news straight and report opinions and positions from all sides than any other cable service or the network evening news.
Matt, I think at the true grass roots it’s more Libertarian fear of “ever creeping Government” than genuine Democratic or Republican thinking. The two major Parties are just piggybacking with their own agenda which as usual is cynically about staying in or being out of office.
[i]And just where will we go in your view for objective reporting? Frankly, I’ll watch Fox news knowing their commenting is slanted without the discomfort of people like Keith Olberman shouting his insane and angry comments at me. Folks like Brit Hume and Chris Wallace are a welcome contrast to Katie Couric, and Tom Brokaw who have had a national platform for years.[/i]
Dcn Dale,
Right, we tend to want to listen to what we are comfortable with. That doesn’t contradict my point.
[i]The CNN “report†on the Chicago Tea Party protest was on Headline News, not a commentary program. Certainly, Fox News commentary programs have bias (O’Reilly, Hannity, etc.). If you look at the actual news coverage, during the day and on the main two evening news programs and on the Sunday morning talk show, you’ll find that Fox makes a much more sincere effort to give the news straight and report opinions and positions from all sides than any other cable service or the network evening news.[/i]
Katherine, I would say that it only “feels” that way. IT feels that way because the “other side” is so uniform in its overall message and control such that any departure from it “feels” more objective. But in fact, it’s only the part some of us life more and is just as lopsided.
On the contrary, “Less (Federal) Government” is certainly an agenda, especially when two administrations, possibly three (Clinton), were devoted to increasing government.
Protesting costly, needless, increasing Government intrusion into our daily lives is a good start towards a grass roots movement to eventually elect qualified Constitutional candidates, not those who wish to expand Government beyond what the Constitution mandates and limits, not to mention the needless debt overspending on pet projects better left to the States jumps into the TRILLIONS of dollars.
#12. Albany+,
[blockquote]That doesn’t contradict my point.[/blockquote]And that doesn’t answer my question to you.
Dcn Dale,
I thought that was obvious from what I said. You and I are left to sort it all out on our own.
[blockquote]But why should we take all this seriously when there are no specifics?[/blockquote]
Because philosophical principles come first, followed by statements of concrete principles. Specifics are the last thing discussed.
And exactly which “current events” are these protestors misinformed about?
#18. Albany+,
[blockquote]I thought that was obvious from what I said[/blockquote]
Uh, no it wasn’t. Try a statement like this on for size, “I don’t believe their is an objective source for our news”. That kind of statement would constitute obvious for me.
Matt, the Tea Party participants are opposing the TARP bank bailouts, the auto bailouts, the “stimulus” bill, and other increased federal spending. That seems quite clear. They are not focused on any one of the above; they are not, at present, a unified political movement. Republican politicians who voted for the TARP funds were booed in a couple of cases. I agree that this won’t make much difference unless it is translated into electoral campaigns next year.
As a side issue, it might be better to refer to them as “tea party participants” rather than anything else [edited by Elf in light of edits further up this column].
Albany+, have you watched Fox News, the news presentations, not the evening commentary shows? Fox does indeed, not just in my feelings, but in fact, present opposing movements and ideas in a more nearly balanced manner than CNN, MSNBC, or the alphabet evenings news programs. On the evening commentary shows you can see heavily conservative- or populist-leaning materials. I’m talking about the actual news segments.
Matt,
“Tea-bagging” is an insulting term, used for a sexual practice (or so I learned on tv). I suggest that if such a term were used of a movement for which you approved you would be the first to go ballistic against the person using the term. So, please refrain from using it in reference to tea party supporters.
libraryjim, #5 – Wow! a teaparty in WBP! I never would have thunk it. That is one of the most liberal bastion of Palm Beach County… (think of all the post-2000 “butterfly ballot” election angst and pro-Gore rallies there!) I’ve not been keeping up much with Florida news of late being so many thousands of miles away here in Africa. I’m glad to hear that even in WPB folks are standing up to say enough.
[Commenters are requested to be careful of terms used and also to give people their proper names. A number of comments have been edited – Elf]
Thanks, Elf. It’s rather sad to think about what words, which are on their faces perfectly inoffensive, can no longer be used politely.
Elves, I agree with Katherine. And thank you for your intervention.
Karen B.
Yep, he said the tea party in WPB was very well attended, as was the rally against illegal immigration the following Saturday.
For pics on the latter, please go to: http://www.aaiie.org
Jim Elliott <>< North Florida
The “tea party” gatherings were a good example of average people being given a venue to express themselves openly . Contrary to what MSM people would suggest, neither Fox nor the Repubs initiated or generated this. They were a conduit. Twitter was another conduit. Even the Governator ( Arnold ) was booed at a Sactramento “tea party” gathering, so it is safe to suggest it was not Republican-driven. For those who are younger, you have to have experienced the absolute continual MSM droning about body counts during the Vietnam conflict to really begin to appreciate the fact that FOX is even around to give another view. Whereas the US nilitary did “win” the Vietnam War, the MSM “lost” it for us. Most Americans were opposed to that conflict at the time, but the libs acted as if only they had a corner on the market. Walter Cronkite appeared grandfatherly and believable, but was totally agenda-driven. Believe me. A word for the “elfs” – presumably used to PC college campuses: I just read a paper called ” The Origins of Political Correctness” ( http://www.academia.org/lectures ). You may be shocked to know its foundations are Marxist – the purpose of political correctness is/was to attempt to translate Marxism from economic terms to cultural terms. It began at the Institute for Social Research and attempted to combine Marxism with Freud ( called Critical Theory ). Women’s studies departments, radical feminism, black studies departments, environmentalism, and gay studies departments – all are branches of Critical Theory. Herbert Marcuse, who used to be at UC San Diego, was a big part of this. The elfs should be aware of this stuff when they start their word control routines. There is a balance between free speech and being extra polite – obviously no one can either assume what another person’s reaction is to what they may say, but all should be entitled to use the English language in a fair way without fear of thought control.
#27. Matt Thompson,
Please Matt, metaphors are not my cup of tea! Wink
PS These are not “reminiscent” of anti-war rallies. These are normal people really upset with the administration hiding and being less than transparent about their motives on multiple issues. I recall that prior to Castro taking over Cuba, he was wondering around the hills of Cuba acting as the proposed “savior” of Cuba from the previous corrupt administration – Batista. He never once admitted or acknowledged he was a Communist or a Socialist. In fact, he was once reported to be a high school exchange student in Glendale, CA – a bright kid. However, once he came into power he became the most ruthless head of state at least in this hemisphere. When I see Hugo Chavez, a close confidant to Castro, and Obama cheering each other on in Trinidad this week, it’s deva vu. According to the Financial Times today, Obama wants to unionize all our banks, fill them with SEIU and ACORNites and tell them what to do. This stuff is not unlike the stuff Castro started out with.
Karen B,
take a look at West Palm’s Tea Party website:
http://letsgetloud.org/?page_id=18
Matt, it might answer some of your questions, too
From their ‘purpose’ sidebar:
West Palm Beach Tea Party Petition We the People of Palm Beach County demand that the governments of Palm Beach County, the State of Florida and the United States of America be accountable to the People and insist on our government to:
– End the bailouts.
– Repeal the largest spending bill in HISTORY.
– Stop fiscal child abuse by spending future prosperity.
– Restore the principles of our founding fathers.
(In other words, they exist to peaceably assemble to petition the government — both rights guaranteed by the Constitution — , much as the anti-amnesty groups succeeded with their move. The Government exists FOR, OF, and BY the people. Gatherings like this serve to remind those elected FOR, OF, and BY the people that they cannot ignore the will of the people. That’s a pretty good “For” reason right there. And it’s interesting that the same people blasting the tea partiers are the same one who support “Code Pink” and Cindy Sheehan and other Liberal protest movements. Double standard, anyone?)
Finally, Matt, why call them anything other than what they want to be called? Isn’t it kind of immature to have to substitute derogatory terms in their place?
Jim Elliott <>< North Florida
#30. Juandeveras,
[blockquote]When I see Hugo Chavez, a close confidant to Castro, and Obama cheering each other on in Trinidad this week, it’s deva vu.[/blockquote]
I think you meant deja vous but actually deva vous works nearly as well or diva vous. (Yes, I know the latter two aren’t grammatically paired words but since I stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night that makes me a linguist)
Deja vous, Dcn Dale? “Already you?” Deja vu=literally, “already seen.”
#34. Sherri2,
deja vous can also be deja vu, the sense that you have that you have experienced something before but your usage is probably preferred. So, maybe staying a a Holiday Inn Express makes me a brain surgeon and not a polyglot.
Whatever it is, it’s like deja vous all over again!*
Jim Elliott
North Florida
*Shamelessly stolen from Yogi Berra.
Matt, no, “tea-tantrumists†isn’t okay, since it expresses your contempt for the protesters. As to the anti-war protests of recent date, they were heavily organized by International ANSWER, and many people attending them carried professionally-produced placards and banners provided by the organizers, and the tone was very ugly, directing personal abuse at the President. In contrast, from what I have seen, these “Tea Parties” were locally and very loosely organized, and most of the signs and banners were home-produced, mostly referencing the issues and not personally ugly towards the President. It appears to have been a genuine grass-roots phenomenon. If people are energized by this into supporting fiscal conservatives for Congress next year and for President in ’12, it will have been a success. If not, it was fun and of no effect.