Q: What has been the situation in this diocese?
A: I have said to the diocese that there will be no permission for blessing of same-sex unions until the General Convention of this church has made a decision.
That is not because I feel that faithful persons in a chaste, loving relationship should not have the grace of God acknowledged by a blessing, but I also am bound as a bishop of the church to be responsible and faithful and obedient.
Q: You said in New Orleans that “sometimes traveling as a body means slowing down the pace, in the hope that all can make the journey.” What should gay and lesbian Episcopalians understand when you say that?
A: I want them to hear that the commitment to the journey of full inclusion continues. We don’t know what it will ultimately look like. But we want them to know we’re still on the journey.
What I have found is that many gay and lesbian Christians are concerned not just about their sacramental inclusion, but about the church. Many have shared that they’re willing for us to pause and have that conversation. There are some who are pretty angry, and I understand that.
[blockquote]There are some who are pretty angry, and I understand that.[/blockquote]
It seems like the Bishops who support the direction TEC is taking understand the anger from the LGBT crowd, but why those self-styled orthodox folks are angry is a total mystery. (Or just blamed on them being backward homophobes.)
If it weren’t so sad, it’d be funny.
I don’t think anybody has a problem with blessing chaste relationships. It’s the unchaste ones that are causing the problem. Or the fact that the definition of chaste now means “serially monogamous outside of marriage.”
Question: Does anyone know whether the numbers of homosexuals in TEC has increased, and if so (as one might suppose) what sort of increase has taken place? LM
Is not giving permission for SSB’s the same as prohibiting them? As one who deas with applied logic on a regular basis, the response is obviously no. The destination remains the same, it’s just that the steam valve has been backed off of “full blast.”
Part of comment removed-ed.
The reporter missed a real opportunity to ask the Bishop what if the Answer given during the conversation remains “No”?
“I have said to the diocese that there will be no permission for blessing of same-sex unions until the General Convention of this church has made a decision.”
So, that means the church will go through this drama again at General Convention”. Will this never end?
[blockquote]That’s our heritage, the quirkiness of Anglicans. We respect that there will be different perspectives about very important things.[/blockquote]
Yeah, but that doesn’t include the foundational blocks of Anglicanism and Christianity such as the ressurrection, the Trinity, the Divinity of Christ and a host of other basics.
the snarkster
…but [b]does[/b] include the relation of faith and works, the nature of original sin, how to be saved, how Jesus saves us, the doctrine of election, the doctrine of reprobation, baptismal regeneration, charismatic gifts, the necessity of conscious conversion, infant baptism, the fate of the unbaptized, purgatory, prayers for the dead, how literally to take Scripture, how to describe the virginal conception and the resurrection, evolution, contraception, women’s role in society, divorce and remarriage, how to worthily glorify God in worship, transubstantiation, receptionism, what (if anything) confirmation does, the priesthood of all believers, whether deacons and deaconesses are in the same order of ministry, the ordination of women presbyters, the consecration of women bishops, the meaning (if any) of apostolic succession, the nature of episcopal oversight, the role of synodical government, and a host of other subjects that seem pretty basic.
snarkster:
Exactly. What this all comes down to are fundamentals of Christianity. It’s not just about the Anglican Communion, but the Christian Communion that we would like to share with the other denominations and the Catholic Church. If you cut through all the layers of political issues, what you get are relativistic, biblically uncertain, spiritual leaders within the church.
until the next General Convention
THE GENERAL CONVENTION CHURCH of THE USA only apparently has bishops who cannot bind any future GC. Of course, any GC cannot bind any future GC.
until the next General Convention
This is a shocking interview from a black man. Does he remember the civil rights movement when the whites asked the uppidity blacks to slow down? If he has no personal memory, has he ever read a history book? What if we were saying the same drivel about black marriages, or the ordination of blacks in the church? I bet he’d change his tune.
RE: #11 – Race is not the same sort of thing as sexual preference.
#8. I must have missed something. What is the purpose of your list? It demonstrates what? LM
[blockquote]This is a shocking interview from a black man. Does he remember the civil rights movement when the whites asked the uppidity blacks to slow down? If he has no personal memory, has he ever read a history book? What if we were saying the same drivel about black marriages, or the ordination of blacks in the church? I bet he’d change his tune. [/blockquote]
Race is immutable. Whether sexual preference is is still debatable, but let’s assume that it, too, is so deeply ingrained that it can be assumed to be immutable. Is it then deterministic as to what the core disagreement is here, i.e. behavior?
Hoping this hasn’t chafed delicate elven sensibilities….
Jeffersonian – does mutable or immutable matter? Does biological or psychological genesis matter? The question is whether same-sex attractions are a normal human trait, or a disordered condition. Race is clearly a trait.
Youj are right, WM, but it is more than that. Being black is not a moral matter since free will is not an issue. On the other hand, homosexual acts are a moral matter and free will is at the core of the problem. Even if homosexuality is genetic – and some probably is – this is still not the issue. AS a normal male, I am hardwired to mate with as many women as I can. This is genetic. The issue is, “Shall I follow what my genes tell me to do?” I know what my fantasies WANT me to do, but I am still free not to follow those fantasies. There are plenty of women around for whom free sex is not a problem so that in fact I could indulge my genetic setup at will, but I have not. If I can defeat the hunger for promiscuity because I can see that I SHOULD defeat it, then a homosexual can do the same. But a black cannot override being black, even if he wishes. LM
LM – I was addressing the [i]attraction[/i] only. Of course, it’s the behaviors which we chose to do or abstain from doing that are the stuff of morality.