I generally agree with their plans. It might be the right tack. I hasten to add thought that while I am personally and religiously very conservative, politically I lean libertarian so I suspect there will be points of respectful disagreement.
My only quibble with the announcement was that it seemed focused like a laser on the issue of sexual deviancy, as though acceptance of this is the problem facing TEO and the other mainline denominations. Such is most definitely not the case. The embrace of homosexuality is a symptom of the problem and not the problem itself.
The real issue is the near complete abandonment of 2000 years of Christian doctrine and morals that had not been controversial until within the last century or so. It is this repudiation of Scripture, and the unbroken tradition of the church on matters of faith and morals as pronounced uniformly by the Fathers, the saints and the decrees of the early church councils that is the source of the modern apostasy of the mainline Protestants.
By becoming fixated on issues of sexuality Greg is playing into the hands of the other side who will claim that his position is representative of the “phobia” which infects orthodox (small ‘o’) Christians, when in reality the issue is much more serious than that. And if the truth is to be admitted to some degree the point from the heretics is not entirely without merit. Let’s be frank. It was not until Gene Robinson came along wanting his pointy hat that open revolt broke out in TEO and people who had otherwise endured or in some cases even supported a myriad of other heresies rose up.
But the rot has been in TEO for a very long time. At the least going back to the embrace of women’s ordination. And some have argued that it even goes back to the early 1930’s when the Anglican Communion became the first Christian denomination of any significance to repudiate the 2000 year old prohibition against contraception.
I stopped following Stand Firm several years ago when it became apparent to me that its contributors considered extreme conservative politics the moral equivalent of Anglican Orthodoxy. Until then, they proved a valuable source of information about the many and various eccentricities and deviations from orthodox Christian faith embraced by the organization calling itself The Episcopal Church. That they have now openly embraced as their primary crusade right-wing politics (they think NRO is too “centrist”?!), my prayer is that T19 will keep its focus on religious news relating to Anglicanism and the Christian churches and not fall into the temptation of regarding American politicians as messiahs.
Dan
I don’t follow Stand Firm too much so I was not aware that they had gone off the deep end and conflated Christianity with right wing politics. If true that is deeply regrettable. Though staunchly orthodox (and Orthodox) I don’t think the government should be legislating private morality and have little patience with neo-cons and social cons.
They are just one side of the big government coin with liberals being on the other. The only difference between Rick Santorum and Obama is which aspects of our lives they think the government should dictate.
I don’t know about that, but I think that when it became evident that the revisionists won in TEC, there was no point in continuing to beat the dead horse of TEC revisionism. The conversation simply turned to other things, like the culture wars where the issue is still in play. Because the culture wars are political the discussions are political.
Thank you so much, Kendall, for noticing this — we are all terribly excited.
If there’s one thing that blogging has demonstrated to me, it’s both the value of earning — if not “the very best” detractors — at least the right detractors for the right reasons [ranging from the low end of general anger, bitterness, and bile, to a sense of threat, to the higher end of stark and plain disagreement with worldview, principles, values, and goals] so that one knows one is doing one’s job, as well as receiving the blessing of unearned friendships from people of like mind and character.
Your blog has led the way and is leading the way. I can’t think of any priest in TEC who has been as courageous and out-front in blogging, [i]and[/i] as penetrating in insight.
Bishop Fitz Allison has said that the conflict in the Episcopal Church and
the Anglican Communion is only a small blip in the larger conflict of the
religion of Secularism waging war against traditional biblical Christianity.
Greg Griffith and board of Stand Firm seem to be aware of the battle for Western Civilization (as Bishop Allison describes it) and they are willing to engage this larger battle.
“it became apparent to me that its contributors considered extreme conservative politics the moral equivalent of Anglican Orthodoxy”
“I don’t know about that, but I think that when it became evident that the revisionists won in TEC, there was no point in continuing to beat the dead horse of TEC revisionism.”
Well said, Dan, and well said, Br. Michael.
I’m beginning to think that the extremists on the Left and on the Right are instruments of a two-pronged attack that Satan is bringing against the Christianity. NEITHER side is Biblically orthodox, and both adulterate the Church by using religion as a tool to push their secular agendas.
“I think that when it became evident that the revisionists won in TEC, there was no point in continuing to beat the dead horse of TEC revisionism”
Well, with Archbishop Rowan heading off for the backwoods, who will protect TEC now from the consequences of their actions? The weak point of the Anglican Communion is about to depart. Leaving behind an almighty mess in what used to be its structure and governance it has to be said.
Nature abhors a vacuum and the vacuum has resigned, fortunately.
Mind you, with the figures coming in and two Cathedral headed for the scrapyard, you can hear the death rattle anyway. Just keep KJS in situ for a bit longer and she will finish the job as well as emptying the coffers, along with the pews. What a pity for what was once a fine church to look up to and a beacon for mission in the world.
“I’m beginning to think that the extremists on the Left and on the Right are instruments of a two-pronged attack that Satan is bringing against the Christianity. ”
I meant to write, “against orthodox Christianity”…. sorry bout that.
Interesting title. Prayers for Standfirm as they shake things up a bit.
I generally agree with their plans. It might be the right tack. I hasten to add thought that while I am personally and religiously very conservative, politically I lean libertarian so I suspect there will be points of respectful disagreement.
My only quibble with the announcement was that it seemed focused like a laser on the issue of sexual deviancy, as though acceptance of this is the problem facing TEO and the other mainline denominations. Such is most definitely not the case. The embrace of homosexuality is a symptom of the problem and not the problem itself.
The real issue is the near complete abandonment of 2000 years of Christian doctrine and morals that had not been controversial until within the last century or so. It is this repudiation of Scripture, and the unbroken tradition of the church on matters of faith and morals as pronounced uniformly by the Fathers, the saints and the decrees of the early church councils that is the source of the modern apostasy of the mainline Protestants.
By becoming fixated on issues of sexuality Greg is playing into the hands of the other side who will claim that his position is representative of the “phobia” which infects orthodox (small ‘o’) Christians, when in reality the issue is much more serious than that. And if the truth is to be admitted to some degree the point from the heretics is not entirely without merit. Let’s be frank. It was not until Gene Robinson came along wanting his pointy hat that open revolt broke out in TEO and people who had otherwise endured or in some cases even supported a myriad of other heresies rose up.
But the rot has been in TEO for a very long time. At the least going back to the embrace of women’s ordination. And some have argued that it even goes back to the early 1930’s when the Anglican Communion became the first Christian denomination of any significance to repudiate the 2000 year old prohibition against contraception.
Still I wish them well.
I stopped following Stand Firm several years ago when it became apparent to me that its contributors considered extreme conservative politics the moral equivalent of Anglican Orthodoxy. Until then, they proved a valuable source of information about the many and various eccentricities and deviations from orthodox Christian faith embraced by the organization calling itself The Episcopal Church. That they have now openly embraced as their primary crusade right-wing politics (they think NRO is too “centrist”?!), my prayer is that T19 will keep its focus on religious news relating to Anglicanism and the Christian churches and not fall into the temptation of regarding American politicians as messiahs.
Dan
I don’t follow Stand Firm too much so I was not aware that they had gone off the deep end and conflated Christianity with right wing politics. If true that is deeply regrettable. Though staunchly orthodox (and Orthodox) I don’t think the government should be legislating private morality and have little patience with neo-cons and social cons.
They are just one side of the big government coin with liberals being on the other. The only difference between Rick Santorum and Obama is which aspects of our lives they think the government should dictate.
I don’t know about that, but I think that when it became evident that the revisionists won in TEC, there was no point in continuing to beat the dead horse of TEC revisionism. The conversation simply turned to other things, like the culture wars where the issue is still in play. Because the culture wars are political the discussions are political.
Stand Firm usually marks its political threads as “Off Topic.”
Thank you so much, Kendall, for noticing this — we are all terribly excited.
If there’s one thing that blogging has demonstrated to me, it’s both the value of earning — if not “the very best” detractors — at least the right detractors for the right reasons [ranging from the low end of general anger, bitterness, and bile, to a sense of threat, to the higher end of stark and plain disagreement with worldview, principles, values, and goals] so that one knows one is doing one’s job, as well as receiving the blessing of unearned friendships from people of like mind and character.
Your blog has led the way and is leading the way. I can’t think of any priest in TEC who has been as courageous and out-front in blogging, [i]and[/i] as penetrating in insight.
Appreciation for your blog — and for the link.
Bishop Fitz Allison has said that the conflict in the Episcopal Church and
the Anglican Communion is only a small blip in the larger conflict of the
religion of Secularism waging war against traditional biblical Christianity.
Greg Griffith and board of Stand Firm seem to be aware of the battle for Western Civilization (as Bishop Allison describes it) and they are willing to engage this larger battle.
May God bless them in this new direction.
“it became apparent to me that its contributors considered extreme conservative politics the moral equivalent of Anglican Orthodoxy”
“I don’t know about that, but I think that when it became evident that the revisionists won in TEC, there was no point in continuing to beat the dead horse of TEC revisionism.”
Well said, Dan, and well said, Br. Michael.
I’m beginning to think that the extremists on the Left and on the Right are instruments of a two-pronged attack that Satan is bringing against the Christianity. NEITHER side is Biblically orthodox, and both adulterate the Church by using religion as a tool to push their secular agendas.
“I think that when it became evident that the revisionists won in TEC, there was no point in continuing to beat the dead horse of TEC revisionism”
Well, with Archbishop Rowan heading off for the backwoods, who will protect TEC now from the consequences of their actions? The weak point of the Anglican Communion is about to depart. Leaving behind an almighty mess in what used to be its structure and governance it has to be said.
Nature abhors a vacuum and the vacuum has resigned, fortunately.
Mind you, with the figures coming in and two Cathedral headed for the scrapyard, you can hear the death rattle anyway. Just keep KJS in situ for a bit longer and she will finish the job as well as emptying the coffers, along with the pews. What a pity for what was once a fine church to look up to and a beacon for mission in the world.
“I’m beginning to think that the extremists on the Left and on the Right are instruments of a two-pronged attack that Satan is bringing against the Christianity. ”
I meant to write, “against orthodox Christianity”…. sorry bout that.