Big talk. Pardon me, but little to no mention of Jesus the Messiah who really lived, really died, really rose from the dead. Despite a South Carolinian moving there, I do not see how they will survive.
There’s an intriguing tension within this statement that I have seen elsewhere–between parishes and ministries. The statement here is clear that the diocesan parishes are struggling, 60 of 105 are in some sort of decline. (BTW I appreciate that honesty.) In the next paragraph however, rather than speaking of building up churches or parishes or congregations, the statement speaks of mission-oriented structures to better support ministries. I surmise that the authors of this statement, like others, have doubts about the integral good of being a church, a community called together by God out of the world (ecclesia) and filled with His Holy Spirit by the grace of Jesus Christ to be an “outpost” of heaven. Churches need ministries–but I am persuaded that the number one ministry of the Church is to be the Church, sinners worshiping an almighty and loving God as His sons and daughters, holy saints by faith in Jesus Christ.
Selling off property to the Muslims for less than half of what true Christians offered them is on their list.
The shortest mission strategem is the most important for the failing diocese and the least probable: [i]”Beginning preparation for a capital campaign to develop the resources necessary to carrying out our vision.”[/i]
This represents what is worst about Episcopalianism:
[blockquote] Having a Commission on Ministry that incarnates Title III of the Canons of the Episcopal Church to be more deeply faithful as we better prepare people for living out the ministry of all the baptized for this time. [/blockquote]
Incarnates? Blech.
I had the pleasure of attending the Anglican Men’s Weekend and we had the opportunity to be taught by Bill Hull. I hope that myself and other participants are able to implement a true Christian strategy, [url=http://www.billhull.net/ ]building a disciple making church. [/url]
Forgive me in advance for responding only to the comments, not the article, but I really want to thank Loren+ for comment #2!
Wow, I love your comment! What a great definition of what it means to be the Church and why it matters. Thanks for putting into such lovely words something that is all too easy to neglect in the busyness of “ministry”!
[blockquote]a community called together by God out of the world (ecclesia) and filled with His Holy Spirit by the grace of Jesus Christ to be an “outpost†of heaven. Churches need ministries—but I am persuaded that the number one ministry of the Church is to be the Church, sinners worshiping an almighty and loving God as His sons and daughters, holy saints by faith in Jesus Christ. [/blockquote]
I’m thankful to say I’m blessed to know something of such community / ecclesia with my team here in Africa. I am grateful for how our shared life has transformed me and helped me grow in love for Christ and others, and for how God has revealed Himself through our witness and worship such that some who had never known Him among our friends and neighbors are now loving, following and worshipping Jesus. Thanks be to God!
Reading the 2008 TEC Charts for the diocese offers little, if any, good news. From 2002 through 2008, the diocese lost 25 percent of Members, lost 22 percent of ASA, and lost 19 percent of Plate & Pledge when adjusted for inflation. Using these data I ranked it at 89 of 95 dioceses considered. The vision of the future is also bleak. Aging is very visible given 246 Infant Baptisms and 395 Burials in 2008. Parish size is not good when one sees that 64 of its 94 churches had ASA of 70 or less and 21 of the 64 had ASA of 20 or less. And Money is visibly tight as 76 of its 94 churches had Plate & Pledge of less than $150K in 2008 which means that each “rich” church had 4 “poor” churches to help support. And the fiscal mess in New York is not going to help. Statmann
Mission oriented, mission, mission, mission…but they never really get down and define the mission. Typical attempt to avoid the clear problem of the Episcopal vision which is their unspoken mission to free the people from the Bible. Until they can repent of revisionism, they have no mission.
They can’t do church like Loren+ suggests – “outposts” of heaven for sinners to worship and draw near to an almighty God. That doesn’t fit the narrative. “Outposts” connotate that there is a spiritual battle and that culture is in the wrong and Christianity is in the right. That is much to paternalistic and jingoistic!
I can only think of the wonderful continuing parish I have visited in Syracuse that is down the street from the shuttered building the folk were forced out from. If you want to find people who are passionately presenting Christ to one another, visit that storefront ministry. Their suffering has produced people who radiate the Spirit and clergy and dedicated layfolk who have also lived the pain and are feeding their sheep. This piece talks about living in an “age” as if it were some sort of enlightened epoch that, once entered, has to be lived out on the world-directed intellectual plane inherent in the times. I think that if the diocese wants to start a self-examination it should begin with that notion as illuminated by the light of Scripture. Talk of radical hospitality is just codetalk for something else and perhaps the true theme of this piece.
Summary: Our mission is to continue to do mission so that we might expand our mission to those who are recipients of our mission, especially those whom we perceive as most in need of our mission. In this time of crisis, (which may or may not have been brought on by our unclarity about our mission), we will respond by continuing with, and expanding our mission.
Fulsome, bloated, hyperbolic prose such as this rarely does anything except disguise failure; that’s exactly why the writers turn to such windbaggery. This is church writing at its worst. Larry
When I was living in the next door Diocese of Albany in the 1980s, it was already clear that the difference between Albany and CNY was like day and night. Albany had a gospel to share and CNY didn’t. And things have only gotten worse in the quarter century since.
Thanks to Statmann for his usual contribution with stats, which are really quite alarming in this case. To lose 22% of your ASA in just 7 years is downright precipitous; not a gentle slide downwards but a steep plummet. And with 1/3 of their remaining churches limping along with an ASA of 20 or less, that calamitous decline is almost certain to continue or get even worse. Without repentance and a lot of conversions, that is.
Big talk. Pardon me, but little to no mention of Jesus the Messiah who really lived, really died, really rose from the dead. Despite a South Carolinian moving there, I do not see how they will survive.
There’s an intriguing tension within this statement that I have seen elsewhere–between parishes and ministries. The statement here is clear that the diocesan parishes are struggling, 60 of 105 are in some sort of decline. (BTW I appreciate that honesty.) In the next paragraph however, rather than speaking of building up churches or parishes or congregations, the statement speaks of mission-oriented structures to better support ministries. I surmise that the authors of this statement, like others, have doubts about the integral good of being a church, a community called together by God out of the world (ecclesia) and filled with His Holy Spirit by the grace of Jesus Christ to be an “outpost” of heaven. Churches need ministries–but I am persuaded that the number one ministry of the Church is to be the Church, sinners worshiping an almighty and loving God as His sons and daughters, holy saints by faith in Jesus Christ.
Selling off property to the Muslims for less than half of what true Christians offered them is on their list.
The shortest mission strategem is the most important for the failing diocese and the least probable: [i]”Beginning preparation for a capital campaign to develop the resources necessary to carrying out our vision.”[/i]
This represents what is worst about Episcopalianism:
[blockquote] Having a Commission on Ministry that incarnates Title III of the Canons of the Episcopal Church to be more deeply faithful as we better prepare people for living out the ministry of all the baptized for this time. [/blockquote]
Incarnates? Blech.
I had the pleasure of attending the Anglican Men’s Weekend and we had the opportunity to be taught by Bill Hull. I hope that myself and other participants are able to implement a true Christian strategy, [url=http://www.billhull.net/ ]building a disciple making church. [/url]
Forgive me in advance for responding only to the comments, not the article, but I really want to thank Loren+ for comment #2!
Wow, I love your comment! What a great definition of what it means to be the Church and why it matters. Thanks for putting into such lovely words something that is all too easy to neglect in the busyness of “ministry”!
[blockquote]a community called together by God out of the world (ecclesia) and filled with His Holy Spirit by the grace of Jesus Christ to be an “outpost†of heaven. Churches need ministries—but I am persuaded that the number one ministry of the Church is to be the Church, sinners worshiping an almighty and loving God as His sons and daughters, holy saints by faith in Jesus Christ. [/blockquote]
I’m thankful to say I’m blessed to know something of such community / ecclesia with my team here in Africa. I am grateful for how our shared life has transformed me and helped me grow in love for Christ and others, and for how God has revealed Himself through our witness and worship such that some who had never known Him among our friends and neighbors are now loving, following and worshipping Jesus. Thanks be to God!
Reading the 2008 TEC Charts for the diocese offers little, if any, good news. From 2002 through 2008, the diocese lost 25 percent of Members, lost 22 percent of ASA, and lost 19 percent of Plate & Pledge when adjusted for inflation. Using these data I ranked it at 89 of 95 dioceses considered. The vision of the future is also bleak. Aging is very visible given 246 Infant Baptisms and 395 Burials in 2008. Parish size is not good when one sees that 64 of its 94 churches had ASA of 70 or less and 21 of the 64 had ASA of 20 or less. And Money is visibly tight as 76 of its 94 churches had Plate & Pledge of less than $150K in 2008 which means that each “rich” church had 4 “poor” churches to help support. And the fiscal mess in New York is not going to help. Statmann
Thanks Statman.
Mission oriented, mission, mission, mission…but they never really get down and define the mission. Typical attempt to avoid the clear problem of the Episcopal vision which is their unspoken mission to free the people from the Bible. Until they can repent of revisionism, they have no mission.
They can’t do church like Loren+ suggests – “outposts” of heaven for sinners to worship and draw near to an almighty God. That doesn’t fit the narrative. “Outposts” connotate that there is a spiritual battle and that culture is in the wrong and Christianity is in the right. That is much to paternalistic and jingoistic!
I can only think of the wonderful continuing parish I have visited in Syracuse that is down the street from the shuttered building the folk were forced out from. If you want to find people who are passionately presenting Christ to one another, visit that storefront ministry. Their suffering has produced people who radiate the Spirit and clergy and dedicated layfolk who have also lived the pain and are feeding their sheep. This piece talks about living in an “age” as if it were some sort of enlightened epoch that, once entered, has to be lived out on the world-directed intellectual plane inherent in the times. I think that if the diocese wants to start a self-examination it should begin with that notion as illuminated by the light of Scripture. Talk of radical hospitality is just codetalk for something else and perhaps the true theme of this piece.
#6 beat me to the punch.
Summary: Our mission is to continue to do mission so that we might expand our mission to those who are recipients of our mission, especially those whom we perceive as most in need of our mission. In this time of crisis, (which may or may not have been brought on by our unclarity about our mission), we will respond by continuing with, and expanding our mission.
Fulsome, bloated, hyperbolic prose such as this rarely does anything except disguise failure; that’s exactly why the writers turn to such windbaggery. This is church writing at its worst. Larry
I equate it with [b]humbuggery,[/b] Larry.
When I was living in the next door Diocese of Albany in the 1980s, it was already clear that the difference between Albany and CNY was like day and night. Albany had a gospel to share and CNY didn’t. And things have only gotten worse in the quarter century since.
Thanks to Statmann for his usual contribution with stats, which are really quite alarming in this case. To lose 22% of your ASA in just 7 years is downright precipitous; not a gentle slide downwards but a steep plummet. And with 1/3 of their remaining churches limping along with an ASA of 20 or less, that calamitous decline is almost certain to continue or get even worse. Without repentance and a lot of conversions, that is.
David Handy+
To quote an old Welsh saying: [b]Heb Dduw, Heb ddim……Without God, without everything.[/b] I think that pretty well says it.